The One About Diet Culture

Tia: Hey, Monica

Amber: Monica

Tia: Welcome to Hey Monica, the podcast that helps you drop the perfectionism to make space for what really matters in your home, in your food, and in your life. Tia, a professional home organizer and founder of Room for Serenity

Amber: And I'm Amber, a weight inclusive licensed nutritionist and founder of Whole U Nutrition and Meal Planning Collective. On today's show, we are talking about something that has shaped my relationship with food and my body, and it's shaped yours too, whether you're aware of it or not. This is also something that I actively work to dismantle, and that, my friends, is diet culture. But first, as always, confessions. Tia, what's your confession for today?

Tia: my confession is pretty straightforward. I did not prepare for today's episode, and honestly, I kinda knew it was gonna go this way 'cause it is a really crazy week. It is the week before school starts for us, there's a wedding that we're attending this evening, and there's just lots of transitions happening in our family and also in my business. It's gonna be okay.

Amber: It's a work in progress, I think is, is fair for us to say.

Tia: How about you? What's your confession?

Amber: my confession is I had too much caffeine yesterday in the form of coffee. I don't think we've talked about it on the podcast. I love coffee, but caffeine is no longer my friend. It makes me jittery and anxious, and it really disrupts my sleep. I just wanted a, special little coffee yesterday, so I had it, and it was delicious, and I was really happy about it until I went to bed last night, so between your not preparing and my lack of sleep, who knows what will happen today on the podcast.

Tia: We're in for a surprise

Amber: like I said at the top, we are talking about diet culture today,

Tia: I am so excited about this because here's the thing, Amber and I have been doing this podcast for quite some time now. So I feel like I should know a little bit more about what Amber does And, generally speaking, I know what diet culture is, I'm coming at it from a place of where probably a lot of listeners are probably coming at it, of like, yeah, I don't like diet culture, and I don't like feeling like I, my body needs to be a certain size to be happy. but that's pretty much the extent of where that goes for me. So

Amber: Yeah

Tia: am genuinely excited to talk about this

Amber: I think diet culture is one of those things where it's, both a little bit obvious and also not at all obvious. We talked about this a little bit in our, I think it was episode two, where we were talking about, perfectionism and the permission to do what works best for you, and I talked about the cycle of socialization, and that's essentially what brings us diet culture, is the cycle of social- socialization. So more information is available on that in that episode. I'll say a few things here, but I'm trying to not completely repeat what I said at that time. I want to just start by saying all bodies deserve respect and care, and that weight does not equal health, weight does not equal fitness, and also that health and fitness are not an obligation.

Amber: No one is required to be striving to improve their health and fitness at any time, and whether they are or they aren't, they're still worthy of respect and care. of course, as a nutritionist, most people come to me because they are working to improve that relationship with food and body, and oftentimes that is due to a concern around health as well.

Tia: can I pause you right there? Because there is a mind-blowing moment right here that I'm like, "Wait a minute. What? Health and fitness are not an obligation?" I don't… How… Let's unpack that a little bit, But when I hear that, I think, "Well, of course it's an obligation. I only have one body. and for me, I have kids, and They can only rely on me if I'm alive. So then I feel like it's an obligation for me to stay healthy for their sake, bare minimum. But help me understand. What? How

Amber: I know.

Tia: not an obligation?

Amber: I think part of it, and this can get very, nuanced and complicated, but part of it is that feels important to you because that's a value of yours. But everyone doesn't have the same values, so no one is obligated to take care of themselves. We'll include links to a lot of things in today's episode, but one of my favorite people who talks about this subject is Ragen Chastain,

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: she has used the example of, this idea of thinking about somebody who might be in a larger body and saying that they're obligated to, lose weight and try to be healthier, she's used the example of an NFL player.

Tia: Mm-hmm.

Amber: We know the risks of concussion and brain injury when you play football at any level, but particularly in the NFL. That's not good for your health, but no one's telling them they don't care about their health. But we don't think about that because the diet culture piece of it has made us all assume that the size of our body and the way that we move our body is equal to health, and the m- the smaller we are, the healthier we are, and if we're not small, we're not healthy, and therefore, we need to take better care of ourselves. But we don't have that same standard for other things, where people are blatantly doing unhealthy things for themselves or things that can risk their health.

Tia: Yeah

Amber: and that's part of the, the nuance and the complication is the expectations around diet culture and how we feel about body size are just so accepted as fact that it's really hard for us to step back and question it. my simple answer to what diet culture is is that it's a societal message that weight and the size of one's body determines health and worth, and that if you have the right mix of motivation and willpower and self-control, anyone can make their body healthy and worthy, I often talk about diet culture as one of those things that once you start to see it showing up, you can't not see it.

Tia: Mm-hmm.

Amber: I think part of moving through that is anger, is one emotion that you'll feel. You'll be so mad that this was just told to you, and you were supposed to accept it and do it, and that you've been, like, punishing yourself in some way trying to meet these expectations.

Tia: Yeah

Amber: And then I think the next feeling for a lot of people is just being lost and floundering 'cause you see diet culture and you're like, "Well, that doesn't work. I'm understanding why that doesn't work, but what am I supposed to do?"

Tia: Yeah,

Amber: where-

Tia: whole foundation of what they thought they were supposed to do is then slipped out from underneath of them, and then, and then what?

Amber: We'll start talking about it today, 'cause it's obviously a much larger conversation.

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: at its core, diet culture is racist, it's classist, and it's sexist. And we don't have time to, deep dive the origins of all of that today, but I highly recommend the book Fearing the Black Body by Sabrina Strings. she really gets into that dark history, and it, it shows that concerns about body size are not about health. They are a form of control and supremacy

Tia: Oh my gosh. I need to read this book.

Amber: talk about things that will make you mad, And again, may- maybe we've already gotten there because, the next thing I had noted for myself is this might be surprising information for anyone just living life, and Tia, I think you demonstrated that with your reaction.

Tia: Immediately. What? How am I supposed to be thinking about my life and worth and body different… I mean, I know, know that I am worthy of so much, no matter what my body size is, but this whole thing about everybody has the ability to have like motivation, discipline, self-control, et cetera, make the right choices for their body and their nutrition, to me, that's just kind of a given. because of that, I have been stressing out and anxious about the fact like why can't I like have better self-control? Why can't I have better motivation?

Amber: how many times have you or me or our listeners heard or said, "Oh, it's calories in, calories out. I just need to eat less and move more. I'm losing weight for my health." these are statements that are just thrown around like, "Hey, how you doing?"

Tia: Mm-hmm.

Amber: no one ever thinks anything of it. And, and listeners, how many of you have counted calories or points or tracked macros or done a Whole30 or eaten keto or paleo, low fat, high protein, tried supplements, medications, exercise programs? I mean, the list is endless. All of those things are diet culture.

Tia: Hmm.

Amber: the tactic might be different. It might change over time. We are currently living in a time where medication is, front and center in this diet culture, body, I'm gonna call it a war, that we have going on. But the results are very predictable, regardless of what that tactic might be, and these results are backed up by nearly a century of data, which is that intentional weight loss can work in the short term, but in the long run, we are left blaming, shaming, and guilting ourselves because the weight comes back.

Tia: goodness.

Amber: the data shows that diets are ineffective about 95% of the time,

Tia: Hmm.

Amber: and that just going on the diet in and of itself can be harmful. So it's not without consequence. It's not like, "Oh, I'll just try it. What's the harm in trying?" There is actually harm in trying

Tia: Hmm.

Amber: some of the harms of dieting, I think the mental and emotional ones are really big. we talked about the guilt and the shame. We see that people who, diet tend to have lower self-esteem. There's an increased risk of eating disorders, which I, I don't know that I like to remind people, but anorexia is the deadliest mental health disorder that we have, and that is an eating disorder. it's so frustrating because a lot of the things that people who live in larger bodies are told to do would be considered an eating disorder in somebody with a smaller body. we're essentially telling people who live in a larger body to eat less food, sometimes to the point that if that person had a lower BMI, which is also a whole like bullshit not true thing that we could get into at another time,

Tia: Hmm

Amber: that we would be like, "Oh, that person has an eating disorder." we're, like, prescribing eating disorders for people in larger bodies essentially. So again, not without risks from that mental and emotional state.

Tia: Wow

Amber: And also our physical health. Weight cycling or yo-yo dieting where you lose weight, gain weight, lose weight, gain weight, that cycle is associated with poorer health outcomes, and this includes things like cardiovascular disease and risk for type 2 diabetes, and it also just increases overall mortality. the risk of dying increases with weight cycling. And we also see that dieting leads to weight regain, and often more than what was originally lost within… Usually, the range is like two to five years. And I just wanna point out, there's nothing wrong with body changes and weight changes. So somebody's body getting bigger is not some sort of failure.

Amber: But if someone is choosing to diet to lose weight, I think it's only fair for them to know that that is not the most common outcome of dieting. And in fact, intentional weight loss is one of the biggest predictors of future weight gain, and this fact just like makes my brain melt and explode at the same time.

Tia: Wow. so then what do we do? 'Cause I'm in that journey myself right now. I, for people who don't know me, all the way up until I got married, and maybe even a little few, a few years after, I was always the same size. I w- I would be considered as thin.

Amber: Yeah, straight size

Tia: I've never needed to work for it in my entire life. I would say in high school I was very active. I was on the dance line, and I was in soccer, and I exercised a lot just because I was active in those sports, right? but like by the time I hit about 35, I started gaining weight a little bit easier, and then that was also the time that I got pregnant-ish, around that time-ish.

Tia: and then I gained a lot of weight during my pregnancy I was a COVID mama, so I don't know what other types of motherhood look like other than just being holed up in your house with your baby. I wasn't even walking to my car and walking to the office and walking up the stairs to my level where I worked. even when I was working in the office before kids, I would take laps around the building with people, not because I would necessarily wanted to exercise per se, but like I just needed to move my body. I would easily get twelve thousand steps a day just by existing in my corporate world life. And then I didn't.

Tia: I was at home with little ones. And ever since then, it has been a struggle for me. I think I've only ever gained weight since then. And so now I'm at the point where I'm like, I don't feel like this is sustainable. Something needs to change because, and back to the value that I stated earlier, I have kids that rely on me. I wanna be healthy so that I can more and be more to people around me. But the way that things are going right now, that it like, the trajectory doesn't look great. So, so what do I do? What

Amber: Yeah.

Tia: I do?

Amber: before I get into, like, more nuts and bolts kinds of things, I do wanna say our current medical system is by default weight-centric. This is also sometimes called weight normative. And the reason that I bring that up is because our medical system is not exempt from diet culture. Our medical system was shaped by diet culture, and so that's where we get a lot of these messages reinforced, and reinforced from so-called experts.

Tia: Hmm

Amber: this weight-centric, weight-normative approach is that societal assumption that people in larger bodies are inherently in poorer health than those that are in thinner bodies. And that is why, lose weight, the eat less, move more, those phrases are, tossed out at doctor's offices without a single question about what you're currently eating or how you're currently moving your body. It's just, like, blanket advice. If your body is bigger, it should be smaller, and this is just what we tell people to do.

Tia: ம்.

Amber: And the reason that that's so frustrating is there is no scientific evidence that long-term weight loss is even possible for people.

Tia: Hmm

Amber: we suffer from a lack of informed consent around dieting and weight loss from doctors. So if a doctor told you, "Lose weight by…" literally fill in the blank. Pick any one of the things I mentioned earlier. Pick something else.

Tia: Yeah

Amber: you need to lose weight by doing this. If you can even manage to do that for more than a few weeks, so how many people do you know that have tried some version of a diet for weight loss purposes, like, uh, keto or Whole30, and they only last a few days because it's so restrictive that they can't keep doing it, or the calories are so low, they're just so hungry they can't keep doing it?

Tia: Mm-hmm.

Amber: assuming you can even stick to whatever the recommendation is, the most likely outcome of whatever it is you're doing, and this does include weight loss drugs too, is that you will regain weight in two to five years, and that your health may be worse off for doing it. If you were told that, would you still do that thing to lose weight? If you were told, in two to five years, you'll be in the same spot, maybe worse off than you are today. And our current system just does not tell people that that is the most likely outcome, that we have data that shows that that is the most likely outcome of intentional weight loss.

Amber: And it sounds so dark and depressing, doesn't it?

Tia: It does. Yeah. And what really makes me frustrated is like, if that data's out there, then why aren't our medical professionals like looking at it, using it,

Amber: Capitalism

Tia: Oh, okay.

Amber: The patriarchy

Tia: Oh my God. my gosh.

Amber: there's is an alternative. I'm not gonna say everyone's going to like the alternative, because the alternative doesn't guarantee your body will shrink, and we're so brainwashed to want that. I feel like we are at a time right now in, mid to late 2026, where the size of someone's body is very much a topic of conversation, starting with Hollywood stars and going all the way down to the person who lives next door

Tia: Oh, yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm

Amber: the way it is right now. the focus on body size in particular right now reminds me a lot of what it looked like in the '90s when the whole, heroin chic, Kate Moss, super thin was considered the ultimate look to have. After years of moving away from that, we have swung very hard back to that, and I'm very disheartened by it

Tia: And may I say the show Friends was a very much, it was a '90s show, and Monica and every single person in that show was very thin, right?

Amber: And Monica, in her teenage years as fat Monica, was a punchline for the show, and, it reinforced all of these diet culture things of her not being as lovable, of her being lazy, of her having no control around food.

Tia: just her not being desirable

Amber: Yeah

Tia: You know, like all these jokes around her not having a boyfriend because she was too big to

Amber: Yeah

Tia: Which, hey Monica, we love you

Amber: Yeah.

Tia: size you are.

Amber: the opposite of weight-centric or weight normative that I just described, where your health is assumed based on the size of your body, is weight inclusive or weight neutral or anti-diet. And the difference is that in a weight inclusive, weight neutral, or anti-diet approach, The focus shifts from intentional weight loss, so using weight as a marker of success to treat and cure whatever it is that ails you, instead of being focused on weight and weight loss, we prioritize overall well-being. we look at, how do we cultivate health-supportive behaviors, like eating in accordance with hunger and fullness cues from the body, finding ways to move that feel good to an individual, It's about figuring out how to manage our stress, prioritize our sleep, and find body acceptance.

Tia: Hmm.

Amber: And that body acceptance piece can be very tricky for a lot of us

Tia: Yeah

Amber: food carries a lot of the challenge of diet culture because we're told that food is a tool that we can use to manipulate our body, but it is our dissatisfaction with our body compared to what we're told beauty is that drives changing that relationship with food. So when we start to accept our body, we no longer need to use food to manipulate the body, and then that relationship changes. But it's really hard to find body acceptance when you are told by doctors that you need to lose weight to be healthy, when every movie you watch and television show that you see is full of small, thin, white people.

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: that can be really challenging. And the other thing that I think is so important and something that I feel like we have not been told is that we have way less say in the size of our body than we are led to believe. I mean, all of the calories in, calories out, eat less, move more are all hung on the assumption that we are able to change the size of our body just by changing what we're eating and how we're moving, and it's just simply not true. We see that genetics in particular, so family of origin there's the whole, thrifty gene theory, there's set point theory. there's a lot of genetic components at play that determine what body size and shape people have.

Amber: Another huge one is social determinants of health, so where you're born and live, if you have financial security or not, the air quality where you live, the education that you receive. also ACEs, so people might have heard of this before, but adverse childhood experiences, essentially any sort of early life trauma also really shapes the way in which the biology in your body works and how you respond to certain cues. if you had a rocky childhood, including things like abuse or divorce, financial instability, all of those factor into how your body responds to different signals and cues. some studies suggest that only about 30% of our health is influenced by health behaviors, and those health behaviors include not only diet and exercise, but also alcohol use, drug use, tobacco use, sexual activity.

Amber: So the part that we have control over, that modifiable part,

Tia: Mm-hmm.

Amber: only about 30% of what makes up our health, I've also seen some people state that as low as 10% of that is related to diet and exercise alone. So we go from being told that as long as we have the motivation and the willpower to change, we can do it, and then when we get down into the numbers, it turns out that changing what you eat and how you exercise might only have about a 10% effect on

Tia: Hmm

Amber: happens with your body. And I think this is such a shocking number to hear because I grew up hearing that diet and exercise is everything. That's all you need to change to change your body. You change your diet, you change your exercise, you change your body, and now there's data out there that says, "Well, actually, that only has about a 10% impact on,

Tia: Mm-hmm.

Amber: on your body and your health."

Tia: here I'm having a whole bunch of confirmation bias right now. I'm recognizing this as you speak because in my mind I'm like, "But I've seen family members who have started to move their body more and then they've lost weight. And then I've seen friends who have changed their diet and then lost weight." And then, like I myself went through, a chapter of my life where I changed significantly what I was eating, and I was what I would say is probably like the best shape of my life. I felt amazing. I had more energy. maybe it's confirmation bias or maybe it's I saw the short term, but I didn't see the long term, you

Amber: You are at the long term right now. This is the long term.

Tia: Yeah.

Amber: You know what I mean? I think this is where the nuance of the conversation comes in, because I'm not saying that what you're eating and how you move your body, isn't an important part of your overall life and life satisfaction and health, because it does matter. I wouldn't be a nutritionist if I didn't think nutrition mattered. but one of the things that I think is super important about nutrition is your actual relationship with the food and not just what the food is that you're eating. Our society has it so wrapped up in our heads that body size and health are equated, that if you have a smaller body, you are a healthier person.

Tia: Yeah

Amber: the thing. You can be healthy and not have a small body

Amber: You can be fit and not have a small body

Tia: I know that I'm not eating as well as I could, and I know that I'm not moving my body as well as I probably should.

Amber: but here's the thing. It's the intentional weight loss piece of it. So if you started to change the way that you ate in a way that felt better in your body, that gave you more energy, that made you feel more satisfied and full, made you feel, better from a mental health perspective, like more stable

Tia: Yeah.

Amber: Those things can all happen without the size or shape of your body changing.

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: And exercise, yes, I would say even more than diet, exercise is great for our overall health. It is not great for making your body smaller. I think a personal trainer is the first person who will tell you that weight loss does not come from going to the gym, but better health sure does. And so finding a way to move your body that feels good to you and not doing it only to see the number on the scale go down

Tia: Mm-hmm.

Amber: is that important internal shift to make. So yes, I'm not gonna tell anyone that eating more fruits and vegetables and increasing their fiber is not going to be better for their overall health because we have a lot of data that says it will be. I'm not going to tell anyone that moving their body is not going to be better for their overall health because we have a lot of data that says, in fact, yes, exercising and moving your body is good for your overall health. What we don't have is data that says losing weight is the thing that is good for your overall health. So what you wanna do is focus on those behaviors, the changing what you're eating, adding a fruit or a vegetable to a meal where you didn't have one before, stirring some beans into your pasta for additional fiber, finding a way to move your body that you like, whether it is walking, or lifting weights, or climbing a mountain, or jumping on a trampoline.

Amber: whatever it is that you like doing

Tia: Yeah.

Amber: because that's the best way that you'll keep doing that.

Tia: Yeah

Amber: And you're not going to get healthier by, never eating sugar again. Your body needs carbohydrates. It is literally the number one fuel source for the brain. So let's have some carbohydrates in our life. But it's that shift where the outcome isn't weight loss. Our focus isn't on changing a number on the scale,

Tia: Hmm.

Amber: it is on other things like how we feel, how we're sleeping. It can be markers like blood pressure or blood sugar. those can be symbols that your body is getting healthier, and all of those things can happen without the number changing on the scale. The other thing is we don't know what will happen to your body. these negative, diet outcomes are based on intentional weight loss, so when the focus is solely on changing the number on the scale. Because here's what happens for most people. They're so focused on the scale that if the number on the scale stops changing, which it will at some point, Then they get frustrated, they say, "It's not working.

Amber: Why am I even doing this?" And then for the next six months they do nothing but eat pizza and ice cream.

Tia: Hmm.

Amber: That is that rebound effect that so many people see as part of the diet cycle. So you start with body dissatisfaction, you make a plan, which is usually, "I'm going to eat this way," or, "I'm going to move this way." You do that for a while. Either you can no longer do it because it is too hard and too restrictive and doesn't fit in with how you live your life, you can't afford it, whatever it is, you stop doing that. You eat all of the things you told yourself you would never have again, and then you go, "See? This is proof. If I eat these things, I just, I can't be trusted around them. I can't have them in my life." And then the cycle starts over again.

Amber: So people go back and forth between restriction and binging, is the most common pattern that you see

Tia: I can understand why, because it

Tia: The message that I tell myself, which is not healthy, but the, the message that I tell myself is if I'm not eating nutritious meals and if I'm not moving my body, I'm not living up to the standard that everybody else is living up to. I just go ahead and assume that everybody else around me has better self-control around snacking on Oreos than I do. and that they're going to the gym every single day, and that they're sleeping eight to 10 hours. I know this logically that doesn't make any sense, but I am so critical of myself when I snack too much or when I'm not moving my body as much as I know I probably should be, or when I'm, like, too busy in a week to meal plan and then we end up having pizza two nights in, you know, in a row And there's hardly anybody else in my life that's telling me, you're probably the only person that has told me like, "Hold up.

Tia: That's probably not sustainable." N- I shouldn't say only person, maybe one of five people in my life that has ever told me like, "That's just not sustainable

Amber: doesn't it feel crappy to be held to the standard that you think you should be doing that is not attainable? I mean, is that any different than someone who feels like they need to decant every single item that they buy at the grocery store into a clear plastic container with a perfect label on the front of it, and if they don't do it, then their pantry is wrong and they're a terrible person?

Tia: I was like, "Where are you going with these?" Oh, oh.

Tia: Yes, a nod to organizing.

Amber: Yeah

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: so again, like nutrition matters, moving your body matters. This is a great setup. Next week I'm going to talk about one of my favorite frameworks for how to change your relationship with food and body, and that's intuitive eating. So we'll talk more about like the Oreo thing that you hinted at next week, 'cause that's an important part of the intuitive eating process. But I think with diet culture, what we need to do is stop pretending that you can tell what someone is based on looking at their body, all of these external things that are placed on bodies, and we all believe them so much we feel that way about ourselves, too.

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: not immune from this. I grew up in diet culture. I still live in the same world. I get all of these messages. it has taken a lot of unlearning and learning to approach things differently

Tia: Hmm

Amber: to where I am today, and it's not a place of perfection. There are still times where I'm like, "Ugh, life would be so much easier if these stupid pants just fit better," even though I know it is, the clothes' job to fit my body, not my body's job to fit into the clothes. Like as much as I know that on a logical level, emotionally that can still be really hard to do. Or looking at pictures, like you said, where you can see that there are differences over time. But focusing on the weight loss piece in particular is the thing that just ruins it for most of us, because that weight piece, we have less control over it than we're led to believe.

Amber: At some point it's going to stop going down, and for most people that is usually before they want it to stop going down, and our response is to throw in the towel of everything, so not focusing on those healthy behaviors of eating regular balanced meals, of moving our body, of getting enough sleep, of managing stress. So if we focus on the behaviors, the things that we can do, and we do them even in like the teeny tiniest baby steps of ways,

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: time that is going to help our health, and I don't have a crystal ball. For some people, that means their body also changes. For some people, it doesn't. No one knows except your body and your body's not telling anyone what's going to happen. So there can be people who make some of these changes and their body does shrink, and there can be people who make these changes and their body stays the same. There can be people who make some of these changes, and they actually get bigger for a while or stay bigger. Like we just don't really know. But focusing on the taking care of your body, making sure it has what it needs, and then letting your body sort out the weight thing

Tia: Hmm.

Amber: is a weight neutral approach to nutrition. feeding ourselves well, and just taking care of our bodies. Which sounds so simple, but it's so hard. It is so hard. I will recognize that

Tia: something that I'm gonna do immediately after this episode is I'm gonna take the scale that's, like, front and center in our bathroom, and I'm just

Amber: Get it out of there

Tia: somewhere else. I don't think I can toss it, 'cause my husband's gonna probably be like, "Where did our scale go?" But I don't want it sitting in the bathroom where I, I go to the bathroom so many times a day, and I see that thing every single time, and it reminds me every single time of where I'm at weight-wise.

Amber: Yeah

Tia: I want to replace that with something healthy from, a weight neutral perspective. So if I'm not looking at the scale for validation, a weight neutral thing I can look at for, like, hey, you're moving in the right direction here?

Amber: How about how you feel?

Tia: Probably a good one

Amber: I know it sounds so, in some ways dumb.

Tia: no number with it. I d- like

Amber: I know. I know.

Tia: I do, I have like a little happiness scale?

Amber: You could have a happiness scale. I think part of it is we're so trained to want to be able to quantify everything down to, a decimal point,

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: and I- living well can't be quantified in that way.

Tia: Mm-hmm.

Amber: your body and what feels good and what doesn't. Which, again, the intuitive eating piece we talk about next week will be really helpful to start to put some…

Amber: Like, how do we… I think of all of this as, like, we do experiments. We try something, we see how it feels in our body, and we use that information to figure out, do we wanna keep trying it or do we need to make some changes 'cause it didn't feel great, or it doesn't work for this reason or that reason? everything is an experiment, and what the result of the experiment is is just information for us to choose the next thing we're going to do or not do. there's no failing, there's no judgment. It's just curiosity.

Tia: Hmm.

Amber: makes you feel most like you? 'Cause most of us don't know.

Tia: Yeah

Amber: I have clients who don't even know what they like to eat because they are so used to following some sort of external diet plan that tells them what to eat, that when they can eat whatever they want, they're like a deer in the headlights. They're like, "Uh, I, I don't know.

Tia: Yeah

Amber: what do I like?"

Tia: I was actually just thinking about that today because I was like, "You know what? I need to find a better breakfast that is easy for me to make, that I enjoy, that isn't too time-consuming," I focus so much on getting my kids fed that so often I don't even have breakfast. I have coffee and then nothing until, like, 10:00 in the morning, and that's just not the… I don't feel good when I do that, so there's a marker. then immediately what I went to was I should make oatmeal in the morning, that's a healthy thing that I should have. And then I stopped myself and I was like, "But I don't even like eating oatmeal."

Amber: I was just gonna say, do you like oatmeal?

Tia: No. I don't like making it, and I don't like eating it,

Amber: probably not the solution for your breakfast

Tia: So I g- have to figure something else out that I genuinely enjoy eating, and that will fill me and satiate me, and also maybe, like, offset the amount of coffee that I drink in the morning too

Amber: You could also eat not, quote-unquote, "breakfast food" for breakfast.

Tia: Hmm. Tell me more.

Amber: you can honestly eat anything at any time of day.

Tia: I suppose

Amber: if, like, l- dinner leftovers are more appealing to you right away in the morning and they're fast and easy 'cause you just like, you know, throw them in the microwave or the air fryer and it's ready to go, and that is tasty and satisfying to you, eat leftovers for breakfast

Tia: How wild is that? That feels like I'm breaking a rule.

Amber: Not. You're not breaking a rule.

Tia: breaking the rules.

Amber: if there's a frozen breakfast sandwich that tastes good to you, start there. See how that feels. Decide from that point this works, this doesn't work, it's enough food, it's not enough food. Like, just try some different stuff and see how it feels and how long you can stand to eat that thing,

Tia: Yeah.

Amber: in a row that that feels okay to you before you need variety. 'Cause everyone is different. Some people can eat the same thing for breakfast for literally every day of most of their life and feel totally fine and get variety at other times of day, and other people are like, "Yeah, I'll have that like twice a week, and then I need something else."

Tia: maybe my, my metric for success here, instead of looking at the scale for validation on whether I'm going in the right direction, it could be to start at 10:00 o'clock in the morning, how does my body feel? Do I feel jittery and starving 'cause I've not had breakfast and I've only had coffee? do I feel like I have and I'm satiated, or, just feeling comfortable at 10:00 o'clock in the morning and I don't feel like I'm gonna go crazy? Maybe the 10:00 o'clock in the morning check, like the pulse

Amber: Check in with your body. And here's the other thing, and this is totally fine and could absolutely happen.

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: say you eat breakfast and you're eating at, like, 6:30 before you're getting the kids up and running out the door, 'cause that's the moment you have to yourself. By 10:00 AM, you might need a snack. So you might go from not eating at all in the morning to needing to eat breakfast and a morning snack,

Tia: Hmm. here's another thing

Amber: yeah

Tia: only do I feel good in my body at 10:00 in the morning, but I enjoy what I had to eat?

Amber: Yes

Tia: Or did I eat it because I felt like I should eat it?

Amber: Yes, should eat it is such a thing. It is such a thing.

Tia: yeah

Amber: And also with the caveat, 100% of the meals we eat are not going to be the most delicious thing we've ever consumed. But more often than not, we should enjoy what we're eating. And some days, yes, it'll be like choking down the leftovers, 'cause we just don't wanna throw them away and need to use it up, and it's kind of meh. That happens.

Tia: Absolutely. experimenting with, what kind of food do I enjoy eating in the morning I gotta figure it out. But anyhow, this is enlightening, because the scale has been the metric of success for my entire life. before I thought that I needed it when my weight was always pretty much the same, till now, because it, I have always been judged based on that. I think a lot of other people can relate to that too.

Amber: I think so too. when I start working with people, I often ask if they would be comfortable with putting weight on the back burner, because what I have experienced personally and seen with clients and read in the research is that the scale is a jerk. Okay, the research doesn't say the scale is a jerk, that's my interpretation of it. I think anyone who has a history of doing any sort of dieting, whether you've done one or 10, has had the experience of, following a diet to the T, doing everything you're supposed to do, and the scale not reflecting that in the way that you think it should, and then you get frustrated and quit the whole thing because it's not, quote unquote, working.

Amber: if we can take out the judgment that the scale provides in terms of what's working and not, and really focus on those behaviors and how they feel in our body and what we like and don't like about them, that will get us further in terms of cultivating those healthy habits and routines than if we're getting our information on success or failure based on that number on the scale. I it's just not a reliable source of short-term information.

Tia: The scale isn't telling you how your heart is beating, or how your lungs are, are breathing, or how your blood is moving through your body, or how your brain is working, and what nutrients your body has absorbed from the food that you ate. processing through how barbaric it seems now to step on a scale to measure whether our internal body is healthy it's now seeming a little bit like,

Tia: what? There's so much more to my body than my weight. the scale isn't gonna tell you that your mood shifted to something better.

Amber: Yeah. diet culture is the, the water we're in, It's the air we breathe. It's just what's around us. we're almost unaware that it even exists until we start to see it and question it, and then these, like, little threads start to unravel, and you can keep pulling it and see more and more where it came from and what's going on. anger, rage, sadness, all of those are common and, I think, appropriate responses as you start to learn more about it. anger at how much time was wasted trying to do all of these things and for reasons you thought mattered,

Tia: Yeah.

Amber: but it's like the intention was, like, 50% off, and it's just, it is a shift in that intention. And this is where the nuance piece comes in. I had said, "Oh, like, fruits and vegetables and fiber, those are good for us. Exercise is good for us." these are shown to promote health,

Tia: Mm-hmm

Amber: a way to do that that is supportive and nourishing, and there's a way to do that that is guilt-inducing and shaming and punishing. And diet culture leans heavy on the guilt, shame, and punishment side of things,

Tia: உம்

Amber: which makes it unsustainable and makes us feel worse and like it's our fault.

Tia: Yeah

Amber: And the anti-diet approach leans into the nourishment side of things, the feeling good, the feeling better side of things.

Tia: Hmm. Mm-hmm.

Amber: And again, the behavior that you're doing could be the same or look very similar, but the intention behind it changes everything

Amber: I will include several links for people who want to learn more. I had mentioned, Ragen Chastain earlier. She has a great weight and healthcare Substack, so she really focuses at that intersection of what happens when you go to the doctor and you need care, and you are living in a larger body, and how you can approach that, and what studies and science do and do not say. She is also a great resource for anyone who has questions about GLP-1s and what's happening with all of that, and what the studies actually show, and what we know and don't know. she's a great, person to follow. I have a series of blog posts on my website that I refer to as the Anti-Diet Starter Kit, so it goes through some of the information we talked about here, but also the hurdles and barriers that people tend to have to go through, including those fears about what will happen to my body.

Amber: Will I just gain weight forever if I, stop dieting?

Tia: Yeah

Amber: I go through a lot of that information. And then there's a lot of really great podcasts out there too, so I will include a list of podcasts that have great support for anti-diet and weight inclusive approaches. with all that, let's talk about what's working now. Tia, what's working for you?

Tia: I love this part of the episode. Okay. So what's working now for me? I, I'm gonna talk about finding the right tool for the job, and for me as an entrepreneur, and I'm not getting paid to say this because I'm not… Yeah. But as an entrepreneur, I have found HoneyBook to be a really great tool for me because it's an easy place where I can my contracts for my home organizing clients, and then also have an immediate invoice as a part of that process. as soon as they see the contract, they sign the contract, they click to next, and it gets to the payment portion. They pay for the service, and it's, like, so seamless, so beautiful, mobile friendly, it's a breeze and it's beautiful.

Tia: So when you find the right tool for the job, it's also quite enjoyable. I'll flip that over to the home organizing side so that maybe it's a little bit more approachable for people who are not entrepreneurs. I was working with a client recently who loves to cook, and she's a really, really good cook. And she had a lot of sauces. she didn't have a great way to see her lovely variety of sauces and vinegars what she told me verbatim was, "I would rather go out and buy another sauce of something, just to know that I have it and so that I can use it in my recipe that evening versus having to dig around and find something." And so me, as an organizer, I'm like, "Oh, let me fix that for you.

Tia: Introduce lazy Susans your pantry," it's the best way to take these heavy liquid sauce things like balsamic vinegar and rice wine vinegar if you put them on a lazy Susan, you can just twist it around and easily see, And suddenly you don't have to buy three, four, five extra things of the same thing because you know exactly what you have at all times. So having the right tool for the job not only makes things more enjoyable, but it just makes life easier

Amber: That's so true. It really does. I was also just thinking about the name Lazy Susan, and Susan is actually a genius.

Tia: She is. she's not lazy.

Amber: She's not. She is incredible

Tia: So Amber, what about you? What's working now for you?

Amber: I have taken a few days off this week, and as a solo business owner, it can be really hard to take time off, 'cause if you're not working, you're not making money. No one's paying you to not work. There's no vacation time. There's no PTO that you're cashing in on. But taking time away from work is so important. I took a few days off, and I've really been focusing on creative things. I've done several sewing projects. I've been working on a knitting project. I've had slow mornings where I just kind of putter around and, do all the things I normally do, but at a much slower pace. I've even done some mini projects around the house.

Amber: it's been a really lovely mix of relaxing and, pleasantly productive,

Tia: That's awesome Well, that is all for today. If you liked today's episode, you can support the show by telling your friends or leaving us a five-star review on Apple Podcast or Spotify

Amber: If you have questions about the show or suggestions for future episodes, you can send us an email at hey monastic podcast at gmail dot com. All show notes and links are available at hey monastic podcast dot com.

Tia: Amber supports individuals exhausted by dieting who want to improve their relationship with food and body. You can learn more and book a free connection call at wholeyounutrition.com. Amber also hosts a virtual community and co-working space dedicated to planning realistic, satisfying, and nourishing meals that actually taste good. Find more and join the collective at mealplanningcollective dot com.

Amber: Tia helps busy professionals with kids who have amazing systems at work but no energy left to create organized systems at home. Book a free consultation at roomforserenity.com or get organizing tips and tricks from her on Instagram. Her Instagram handle is @room_F-O-R_serenity.

Tia: Bye, Monica

Amber: Bye.